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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#11  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 08:24 
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Sparky114 wrote:
Not as bad as it has been in years gone by [drink-coffee.gif]


No not at all,makes you consider going through it all again just for the hell of it [veryhappy.gif] Although we are over all the visa hurdles now thank goodness, lets hope for those in the future that this is the end of the big fee hikes now

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#12  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 10:31 
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Thank god those visa hurdles are almost gone here too.

Lena graduated for her Dutch exam, which means that coming july she can apply for citizenship (and in the same breath she will give up her ukrainian one, as it is illegal to have 2 in the Ukraine. Fine 25000 euro + 10 years in jail)

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#13  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 13:18 
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Markje wrote:
Thank god those visa hurdles are almost gone here too.

Lena graduated for her Dutch exam, which means that coming july she can apply for citizenship (and in the same breath she will give up her ukrainian one, as it is illegal to have 2 in the Ukraine. Fine 25000 euro + 10 years in jail)


Mark, do you or your wife know of anyone who has been fined and/or jailed?

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#14  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 20:00 
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Chris wrote:
Markje wrote:
Thank god those visa hurdles are almost gone here too.

Lena graduated for her Dutch exam, which means that coming july she can apply for citizenship (and in the same breath she will give up her ukrainian one, as it is illegal to have 2 in the Ukraine. Fine 25000 euro + 10 years in jail)


Mark, do you or your wife know of anyone who has been fined and/or jailed?


Nope we don't , but we do know that the latest flaws in the law have been repaired so she doesn't want to take any risk, considering that conditions in Ukrainian jails (especially for women) are not that good.

My wife also strongly recommends not waking sleeping dogs if you have had a double nationality 6+ months already.

The cases that ARE strongly enforced, are young men with dual nationality (ukrainian + other) of 18-21 years of age entering Ukraine. They will be immediatly enrolled in the Military as mandatory service for 2 years. (examples enough on google of this)

It seems however, that ukraine is friendly in this case ,because the embassy of your country will warn you when it is time to choose (and enter the military if you choose Ukraine)

The other cases where dual nationalities have been put "through court" what she can find, mostly revolves around Russian/Ukrainian duals. Ukraine is keen on keeping russia at bay during the previous presidents, now with the pro-russia back in charge we don't know what will happen.

Mark.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#15  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 20:08 
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For those who can read / Understand ukrainian on this subject:

3 Feb 2012:

У Верховній Радi зареєстровано урядовий законопроект про запровадження штрафів за подвійне громадянство.
Даний законопроект 1 лютого внесений Кабміном до парламенту.
Законопроект пропонує внести змiни до низки законiв України "в частинi встановлення обмежень для осiб, якi є громадянами України та одночасно перебувають у громадянствi iншої держави".
Зокрема, пропонується за неподання або несвоєчасне подання громадянином України, який добровiльно набув iноземне громадянство (пiдданство), заяви про це та копiї документа, що пiдтверджує цей факт, застосувати штраф вiд 10 до 30 неоподатковуваних мiнiмумiв доходiв громадян.
"Тi самi дiяння, вчиненi службовими особами органiв державної влади та органiв мiсцевого самоврядування, спричиняють накладення штрафу вiд 50 до 100 неоподатковуваних мiнiмумiв доходiв громадян", - зазначено в законопроекті.
Так само законопроектом вводиться обмеження на зайняття особами, що мають подвійне громадянство посад у СБУ, Антимонопольному комітеті, податковій, Рахунковій палаті та інших державних установах.
У пояснювальній записці до проекту закону зазначено, що законодавство України не визнає подвiйного громадянства, але на сьогоднi значна кiлькiсть українцiв одночасно з громадянством України має громадянство iнших держав.
"Це негативно впливає на захист iнтересiв зазначеної категорiї громадян України за кордоном, функцiонування органiв державної влади України та створює загрози її нацiональнiй безпецi", - йдеться в пояснювальнiй записцi.
Як відомо, на сьогоднішній день, один неоподаткований мінімум становить 17 гривень.
Українська правда

http://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2012/02/3/6950951/

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#16  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 20:37 
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Markje wrote:
Chris wrote:
Markje wrote:
Thank god those visa hurdles are almost gone here too.

Lena graduated for her Dutch exam, which means that coming july she can apply for citizenship (and in the same breath she will give up her ukrainian one, as it is illegal to have 2 in the Ukraine. Fine 25000 euro + 10 years in jail)


Mark, do you or your wife know of anyone who has been fined and/or jailed?


Nope we don't , but we do know that the latest flaws in the law have been repaired so she doesn't want to take any risk, considering that conditions in Ukrainian jails (especially for women) are not that good.

My wife also strongly recommends not waking sleeping dogs if you have had a double nationality 6+ months already.

The cases that ARE strongly enforced, are young men with dual nationality (ukrainian + other) of 18-21 years of age entering Ukraine. They will be immediatly enrolled in the Military as mandatory service for 2 years. (examples enough on google of this)

It seems however, that ukraine is friendly in this case ,because the embassy of your country will warn you when it is time to choose (and enter the military if you choose Ukraine)

The other cases where dual nationalities have been put "through court" what she can find, mostly revolves around Russian/Ukrainian duals. Ukraine is keen on keeping russia at bay during the previous presidents, now with the pro-russia back in charge we don't know what will happen.

Mark.



Thanks for that, it seems it is still a bit of a grey area, but is risky and will no doubt get riskier over time as they get their act together.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#17  PostPosted: 21 Feb 2012 20:39 
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Markje wrote:
For those who can read / Understand ukrainian on this subject:

3 Feb 2012:

У Верховній Радi зареєстровано урядовий законопроект про запровадження штрафів за подвійне громадянство.
Даний законопроект 1 лютого внесений Кабміном до парламенту.
Законопроект пропонує внести змiни до низки законiв України "в частинi встановлення обмежень для осiб, якi є громадянами України та одночасно перебувають у громадянствi iншої держави".
Зокрема, пропонується за неподання або несвоєчасне подання громадянином України, який добровiльно набув iноземне громадянство (пiдданство), заяви про це та копiї документа, що пiдтверджує цей факт, застосувати штраф вiд 10 до 30 неоподатковуваних мiнiмумiв доходiв громадян.
"Тi самi дiяння, вчиненi службовими особами органiв державної влади та органiв мiсцевого самоврядування, спричиняють накладення штрафу вiд 50 до 100 неоподатковуваних мiнiмумiв доходiв громадян", - зазначено в законопроекті.
Так само законопроектом вводиться обмеження на зайняття особами, що мають подвійне громадянство посад у СБУ, Антимонопольному комітеті, податковій, Рахунковій палаті та інших державних установах.
У пояснювальній записці до проекту закону зазначено, що законодавство України не визнає подвiйного громадянства, але на сьогоднi значна кiлькiсть українцiв одночасно з громадянством України має громадянство iнших держав.
"Це негативно впливає на захист iнтересiв зазначеної категорiї громадян України за кордоном, функцiонування органiв державної влади України та створює загрози її нацiональнiй безпецi", - йдеться в пояснювальнiй записцi.
Як відомо, на сьогоднішній день, один неоподаткований мінімум становить 17 гривень.
Українська правда

http://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2012/02/3/6950951/


I read this, think I have seen it before actually, but it takes a bit of digesting.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#18  PostPosted: 22 Feb 2012 11:26 
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Chris wrote:

I read this, think I have seen it before actually, but it takes a bit of digesting.


According to my wife, this makes things better on one side and worse on the other.

The better: on your first offence, you can still give up your ukrainian passport (mandatory!)
The worse: Fines & jailtime have a better solid ground in the law and can be enforced once this is put through the legislators.

I also read about the procedure to actually give up your ukrainian nationality, and it is not that easy!

1) Get a permanent living abroad stamp in your international passport. After that, you will also loose your internal passport which is sent to kiev.
2) Get signed & notarized statements from all your family (and ex-husbands/wifes) considering childsupport, marriage, debts, etc.
3) you can finally do it and become a single-citizenship person again.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#19  PostPosted: 22 Feb 2012 19:38 
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Markje wrote:
Chris wrote:

I read this, think I have seen it before actually, but it takes a bit of digesting.


According to my wife, this makes things better on one side and worse on the other.

The better: on your first offence, you can still give up your ukrainian passport (mandatory!)
The worse: Fines & jailtime have a better solid ground in the law and can be enforced once this is put through the legislators.

I also read about the procedure to actually give up your ukrainian nationality, and it is not that easy!

1) Get a permanent living abroad stamp in your international passport. After that, you will also loose your internal passport which is sent to kiev.
2) Get signed & notarized statements from all your family (and ex-husbands/wifes) considering childsupport, marriage, debts, etc.
3) you can finally do it and become a single-citizenship person again.



Just a thought Mark, you don't have to answer if you don't want, does your wife own or is likely to own (maybe by inheritance) any property in Ukraine?

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 Post subject: Re: Latest News from the UKBA
Post Number:#20  PostPosted: 22 Feb 2012 20:16 
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Chris wrote:
Just a thought Mark, you don't have to answer if you don't want, does your wife own or is likely to own (maybe by inheritance) any property in Ukraine?


She already owns a flat, currently occupied by her mum. She will sell it when it becomes vacant (may that be far in the future!)

She will have to sort that out before any nationality switch occurs.

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