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 Post subject: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in droves
Post Number:#1  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 00:52 
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Why Young Entrepreneurs Are Fleeing Russia

By Simon Shuster / Moscow Monday, July 18, 2011

When he was 17 years old, Alexei Terentev, then a bookish high school student in Moscow, created what the Russian government has been desperately trying to engineer — a start-up with some of that Silicon Valley–style magic. It was innovative, cleverly marketed and could be run out of his parents' apartment. By June of last year, when Terentev got his diploma from one of Moscow's elite universities, his company was on its way to making him a millionaire. But it was also getting big enough, he says, "to get the wrong kind of attention from officials." So Terentev, now 22, took no chances. One day after graduation, he packed up his laptop and emigrated to the Czech Republic, taking his company with him. He doubts he will ever return.

The reasons for his move, as well as his haste, are the typical worries of the young entrepreneurs Russia is currently hemorrhaging: corruption and bureaucracy, the forces that are driving the biggest exodus since the fall of the Soviet Union. In the past three years, 1.25 million Russians have emigrated, most of them young businesspeople and members of the middle class,

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/ ... z1SVXpHbQH


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#2  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 13:40 
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Sounds every so slightly exagerated to me, 1.25 million is almost 1% of the population

Easy to believe for those who believe everything in Russia is corrupt and bad, i think this article is just mostly sensationalism.

We have similar situation in the UK with lots of "Mafia" types extorting money from good business's , they are disguised as the Government, local councils, Tax man, Banks, Solicitors etc , the Russian system just works a little different , if you want to make money you just need to understand and play the system in whatever country you live.


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#3  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 17:19 
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Julian,

It seems to me that we are reading from the same page regarding the sensationalist aspect of the above article.


ImageImageImage


What puzzles me is what is in the wings.

On one hand we have the current government (Dyadya Vova) Uncle Vova painting his government "whiter than white".
Some selected examples:


On the other hand we have articles such as the one that started this thread and this one from theImage's Radio 4 painting Dyadya Vova's Russia "blacker than black".

Are we witnessing an attempt to influence the forthcoming elections in March?

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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#4  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 20:38 
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Julian wrote:
Sounds every so slightly exagerated to me, 1.25 million is almost 1% of the population


No it isn't.
It's 10% of the population.
[rolleyes.gif]


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#5  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 20:48 
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So are we saying that Russia isn't corrupt?

I think the article is pretty well balanced and tells the truth.

I think those that try to portray the UK as being corrupt as Russia are either Russians or clinically insane.

Get a grip for goodness sake.

[rolleyes.gif]


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#6  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 22:04 
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Malcolm wrote:
Julian wrote:
Sounds every so slightly exagerated to me, 1.25 million is almost 1% of the population


No it isn't.
It's 10% of the population.
[rolleyes.gif]


From the CIA World Fact Book

Russia
Population: 138,739,892 (July 2011 est.)

So 10% would equate about 13.8 Million and 1% would equate about 1.3 million.

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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#7  PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011 22:11 
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Malcolm,

I don't think that any is trying to say that corruption is not rife in Russia I also don't think that anybody (at least on this forum) is trying to say that the corruption in the UK is on the same level as it is in Russia.

I will though state that whether we like it or not (at least in my opinion) the UK does have it's own corruption problems.

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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#8  PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011 07:39 
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Rasboinik wrote:
Malcolm,

I don't think that any is trying to say that corruption is not rife in Russia I also don't think that anybody (at least on this forum) is trying to say that the corruption in the UK is on the same level as it is in Russia.

I will though state that whether we like it or not (at least in my opinion) the UK does have it's own corruption problems.


And so does the USA. It's a different type of corruption. It's much easier in my opinion for a person to put up with the corruption in the USA then to put up with what happens in Russia.


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#9  PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011 07:45 
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Rasboinik wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
Julian wrote:
Sounds every so slightly exagerated to me, 1.25 million is almost 1% of the population


No it isn't.
It's 10% of the population.
[rolleyes.gif]


From the CIA World Fact Book

Russia
Population: 138,739,892 (July 2011 est.)

So 10% would equate about 13.8 Million and 1% would equate about 1.3 million.


Unfortunately Russia's population is on the decline. There is a census which shows that Russia's population could shrink by as much as 25 to 30 million by the year 2050. That would not be a good thing if China (population 1 billion) were to decide to invade the Russian far east. And it's also not good considering that they have large Muslim populations on their borders which are probably growing. You would think that the Russian government would do a lot more to stop the brain drain and female drain (fertile women who leave for greener pastures in the west or now even Turkey). You would also think that they would do more to integrate orphans into society. But they get a D- on all scores.


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 Post subject: Re: Why young Russian entrepreneurs are leaving Russia in dr
Post Number:#10  PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011 10:00 
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Malcolm wrote:
So are we saying that Russia isn't corrupt?

I think the article is pretty well balanced and tells the truth.

I think those that try to portray the UK as being corrupt as Russia are either Russians or clinically insane.

Get a grip for goodness sake.

[rolleyes.gif]


Sorry Malcolm but if you think the article is balanced and tells the truth then it shows that you realy need to spend more time in Russia to understand her , maybe your opinions are based on watching movies, reading BS on internet and talking down the pub with your mates, have you lived and worked in Russia ?, do you know really how life is there or is everything you know based on preconception ?? Its articles like this that fuel peolpe like you to just write negative things about Russia, you don't think the world is full of corruption ? every city, every business has somebody trying to take money from it, wherever you are - go and live in Manchester and open a business there and tell me thats not corrupt and everything is perfect in the UK. The fact is most people in the west have no idea and cannot understand and appreciate how the Russian system works, everything there is so different to here, if you know how to play the system i'm sure its very good to make business there, otherewise Moscow would not be one of the biggest and most expensive and richest citys in the world.

Where ever i go on holiday Russians seems to out number other nations, why is this, they seem to be the ones with the money, i think things are better in Russia than they are here, maybe they have it right and its us who is wrong. I was in Thailand in January for 2 weeks with Russian friends who have good business's, it was full of Russian tourist, not once did any of them complain about corruption or business problems, again in June i stayed in a 5 star resort with many wealthy Russian business people, my wife was talking with many and again nobody spoke of problems. They would appear to be content. My wife is chief accountant for a big company in her town who also have an office in Moscow, i asked her yesterday about Krysha, she said 10 years ago it was a problem but nothing now in her town, the Police have it under control and certainly there is no mafia in this town anymore.

No way have 1.25 million Russians left because of corruption in the last 3 years, what i load of tripe, if they can't play the system they know then what chance of business success have they in a foreign land ??? all developed countries are full of Beaurocracy and i'm sure my American friends will confirm that the USA is just as bad as Russia for paperwork and in the UK we cannot move without being spied on and taxed !!! Malcolm get a grip son, your cacooned in a dream world, this country of ours is full of crime just like Russia. For sure some Russians will have left to get better paid jobs, for example i know that my wife who is very highly qualified in Russia as an accountant can earn 10 times more in Moscow than her home town and probably double that again if she could do the same job in the UK, so people will move if they have possibilty to ain better life, how many thousands have left this country to work abroad and getter better jobs ???, it not because of corruption.

I have lived in Russia for many months over the last 5 years, granted i have not lived in Moscow, but the small industrial town where my wife lives i have never seen any problems with crime, no evidence whatsoever of Mafia and really its nothing like what i percieved before i went to Russia. My opinion has changed a lot over the last 5 years, now i start to understand some things there i realise its not such a terrible place, granted i would not live there but no way is it as bad as some people would have you believe.

As many know i have had several visa issues whilst in Russia and been facing quite large problems, only once have i managed to bribe my way out of a situation and it was way harder than you could imagine and done in a very secretive way, the help was not volunteered by my wife or friends, i had to push the issue to make it happen and my wife was reluctant but she knew that i was in quite a tricky situation and even then i only gave 1000 rubles as a sweetner to get my visa registered and a small error overseen, for this reason i get the impression that its not as common practice as we all think and obviuosly anybody getting caught excepting a bribe would be in serious trouble and risk loosing their job. Of course i am only talking about this one town, maybe somebody can tell me that in their town in Russia corruption is rife.

I feel that the reputation of Russia needs to change, we should cut them some slack and not base all our opinions on the past, of course they need to do a lot more to give the west confidence and to encourage people there or do they ? do they really need or want us there ?? i don't think so, if they where desperate for money and our business they would do more to make it easy, they are clever people - they obviously know how to get money when they need it, i think it is Russia who laughs at us. Maybe we think that Russia needs us more than we need them.


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